Is it possible to organize, or should it be possible to organize boycotts and other civil acts against an entity which acknowledges that it has supported terrorism?

If you purchase products from a corporation which has officially acknowledged it has paid money to groups that then have committed murder with the funds received from that corporation, is the corporation a sponsor of murder and terrorism? Especially, if hundreds if not thousands of people have been murdered with this financial support?

What brought this topic to mind was the following story which I see as an horrific example of wrong-doing being "justified" by our government and corporate "leaders."

Colombian Prosecutor Probes U.S. Firms

Monday April 30, 5:35 AM EDT

BOGOTA, Colombia (AP) — Colombia's chief prosecutor stood between the white plastic-sheathed remains of two dismembered teenage sisters. On the rust-colored dirt around him lay remains of nearly 60 newly unearthed victims of paramilitary death squads.

Not just their killers but those who bankrolled them must be brought to justice, Mario Iguaran told reporters last week at the mass grave in the country's eastern plains.

"You can clearly see that they didn't pay for security, but for blood," Iguaran said.

He spoke ahead of a trip to Washington this week to seek aid for his overburdened office and help obtaining evidence against U.S.-based multinationals he's investigating for allegedly financing the paramilitaries.

Iguaran meets with U.S. Attorney General Alberto Gonzales on Monday and Sen. Patrick Leahy of Vermont, chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee, on Tuesday. With both, he is sure to talk about Chiquita Brands and the Alabama-based coal company Drummond Co. Inc.

Thousands of Colombians disappeared in the past decade, most victims of right-wing militias that emerged in the 1980s to fight leftist rebel groups.

The paramilitaries quickly evolved into mafias, enriching themselves through cocaine trafficking, theft and extortion in large chunks of the country, particularly the Caribbean coast. Large landowners, politicians and corporations bankrolled the militias to expand their holdings, while police and military officers turned a blind eye.

President Alvaro Uribe, a firm U.S. ally, has cracked down hard on the left-wing guerrillas, while negotiating a peace pact with the paramilitaries in 2003. Ex-paramilitary fighters seeking to benefit from reduced sentences under a government amnesty have led authorities to clandestine graves in vast areas they once controlled.

With thousands of victims still to be unearthed, Iguaran is now going after the businesses that he alleges helped pay the bills.

Fruit giant Chiquita agreed in March to pay $25 million to settle with the U.S. Department of Justice after acknowledging that its Colombian subsidiary, Banadex, secretly funneled $1.7 million to the death squads operating in zones where it had banana plantations.

In 2001, a Banadex ship was used to unload 3,000 rifles and thousands of rounds of ammunition for the paramilitaries. At the time, the paramilitaries were consolidating control of the Uraba banana region through massacres and assassinations. Chiquita later sold Banadex but still buys Colombian bananas.

Cincinnati-based Chiquita says it was a victim of paramilitary extortion. In a statement it said its payments to the militias "were always motivated by our good faith concern for the safety of our employees."

But a number of leading Colombians have demanded the extradition of U.S.-based Chiquita executives. And last week, Rep. William Delahunt, a Democrat from Massachusetts, called for an investigation into the practices here of both Chiquita and Drummond.

"This was a criminal relationship," Iguarn said. "Money and arms and, in exchange, the bloody pacification of Uraba."

Drummond is being sued by the families of three union activists killed in 2001 while employed at one of its Colombian mines. The lawsuit, to be heard this summer by a federal judge in Alabama, alleges the company paid paramilitaries to kill the men. Drummond denies the charges and says its executives have had no dealings with any of Colombia's armed groups.

Witnesses for the plaintiffs contend Drummond's security team worked closely with paramilitaries. And opposition lawmakers have accused one security coordinator employed by Drummond, retired army Col. Julian Villate, of conspiring to assassinate leftists and union members.

Drummond calls the allegations baseless. Villate, who worked in an undisclosed capacity for the U.S. Embassy in Colombia two years ago, has not answered the charges.

Businesses saw backing paramilitaries as a lesser of evils. Colombia's leftist rebels have long targeted multinationals, bombing oil pipelines and, in Drummond's case, coal trains bound for its Caribbean port.

Many jailed paramilitary bosses think that just as they were compelled to confess their crimes under Uribe's peace pact, so should their pinstriped backers.

The paramilitaries' main spokesman, Ivan Duque, told The Associated Press in Medellin's Itagui prison this month that many commanders intend to begin speaking publicly about "the financing by the banana industry, some coal companies, big national businesses."

"Those who broke the law," he said, "must face the consequences, just as we are."

———

Associated Press writers Darcy Crowe and Frank Bajak contributed to this report.

http://finance.myway.com/jsp/nw/ nwdt_rt_top.jsp?news_id=ap-d8oqr h6g0&.html

That was over 30 years ago. The nature of todays protest is basically a dog and pony show that nobody pays attention to.

Don't get me wrong, a protest could possibly create change, but with the sort off odd aura surrounding those in positions of power as of later, the scope would have to be enourmous, like tens of thousands of people.

Otherwise it's just another group of hippies/brown people waving signs. Politicians hate hippies and brown people.

And by later I mean late. What an oddly ironic typo.

I would love to hear what some of the Stop Genocide Now folks, Jim Fussell and others in that realm have to say about this. There are existing discussions about divestment of Sudan around here somewhere.

Then I would love to hear too from someone like Ethan McCutchen of grasscommons.org to find out if their tool, Hooze.org would be able to help people take buying and investment action/protest.

Jared, are your statements about shareholder activism or about demonstrations--are you speaking of all forms of protest or particular ones?

Boycotts are "theoretically" a good political reaction, yet, unvariably, it's the poorest among the poorest who bear the consequences!

Boycotting products coming from countries where children are used for their making is a good initiative, but, in the end it's also vital to go on the spot and help NGOs which manage to "take" the children from the "factories" and protect them in centers. I'm talking about India.

All the clothes of famous brand names are made in poor countries, once it's proved that there are children involved or women exploited, then we must take measures, but see also how we can give something in exchange, and help, because the children only bring some cents to provide food to the family.

Campaigns, anti ads should warn people from rich countries, and I'm sure this trade would plummet!

In South Africa, I'm not certain the boycott put an end to aprtheid, it's thanks to the struggle led by Mandela, and the ANC, and then by D.W De Clerk, once the whites admitted their stupidity in exploiting the blacks.

Today boycotts and petitions are numerous, actions are the only means to really stop profits made in the name of money.

Demonstrations are sometimes frightening enough for the governments to change ideas, in France, we know that sort of "dialogue" and very often use it!

Jean ~ Nurture Girl ~ Russell said:

I would love to hear what some of the Stop Genocide Now folks, Jim Fussell and others in that realm have to say about this. There are existing discussions about divestment of Sudan around here somewhere.

Then I would love to hear too from someone like Ethan McCutchen of grasscommons.org to find out if their tool, Hooze.org would be able to help people take buying and investment action/protest.

Jared, are your statements about shareholder activism or about demonstrations--are you speaking of all forms of protest or particular ones?

Partiular forms, like picketing and rallys. I think what I meant to say (and considering it was sometime in the early morning when I said it, I did a poor job) was that protests are less effective now than they used to be. Don't get me wrong, they can still be effective, but it takes dispraportionately more effort to get the job done. We have tons protests all over the world every year, and besides the handful of organizations that do good on a large scale and the extremely local protests (I'm talking small town) they don't seem to have much impact on the policy of anything at any speedy rate.

Maybe twenty or thirty years down the line when I see some of the worthy, current human rights and equality protest groups make some progress I'll change my mind, but for now I'll stick with playing the Devil's advocate.

Unfortunately, the struggle between the 'elephants' brings heavy consequences to the 'ants' of the 'global village'. Certain parts of the 'village' possess their own historical and practical experiences with terrorism and state terror. For example, the Balkan experience confirms the well-known thesis that one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. It seems that the global, regional, and national dimensions of terrorism propel each other, as their configurations are changed through mutual intercourse. Therefore, theoretical demarcation between several crucial notions, such as terrorism, terror, freedom fighters, guerrilla, rebels, etc. has immense utility in today's circumstances. The significance of such a demarcation goes beyond academic purposes, because the potential (mis)use of each of these categories has an immediate political consequence. On the other hand, it is also true that the politicians seldom follow scholars' advice or have time or understanding for their research findings. Unfortunately, in this era of serious terrorist threats, political understanding prevails over critical intellectual thinking.. http://www.transnational.org/SAJ T/forum/meet/2002/Vankovska_Stat eTerror.html Brian Lewis said:

If you purchase products from a corporation which has officially acknowledged it has paid money to groups that then have committed murder with the funds received from that corporation, is the corporation a sponsor of murder and terrorism? Especially, if hundreds if not thousands of people have been murdered with this financial support?

What is the standard against which you measure a boycott working? What works better? Buying stock and voting the proxies?

I suppose one could argue that one standard would be the proprtional boycott response in relation to the size and control of both the company being protested and the markets they reach.

Wal-Mart still hires illegal aliens to underpay, last I checed.

Gapkovska Irena said:

For example, the Balkan experience confirms the well-known thesis that one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. It seems that the global, regional, and national dimensions of terrorism propel each other, as their configurations are changed through mutual intercourse. Therefore, theoretical demarcation between several crucial notions, such as terrorism, terror, freedom fighters, guerrilla, rebels, etc. has immense utility in today's circumstances.

I am of a different opinion.

I believe that all so-called, "freedom fighters, guerrillas, rebels," terrorists, soldiers, marines, sailors, gladiators, knights, and other swash-bucklers, mercenaries, and private contractors, all the members of warrior-culture, and their well-paid stooges, who presently dominate OUR international culture are thugs and murderers.

THEY must ALL be stopped.

WE must eliminate all the sub-categories of violence and make ALL violence illegal: State-sponsored, individual and corporate.

WE must make it plain that it is no longer okay for any type of warrior-thug to murder the rest US, US being ALL the people who want and love peace and security and safety.

Additionally:

I would say that "If you [KNOWINGLY] purchase products from a corporation which has officially acknowledged it has paid money to groups that then have committed murder," then YOU are a murderer as well.

Well--have you bought any bananas recently?

Have you bought any gas by Shell Oil? The Ogoni People of Nigeria have been killed by Shell Oil money. But that was year ago too and now the place is a waste land.

This is an extremely complicated topic -- as usual Brian. I have sat at dinner with gun runners from England, Iraq and Iran and the UNICEF education specialist and a high raking person from the Ministry. I have had drinks and walked on the beach with South African Mercenaries that were protecting government interests against the rebel forces. I have seen the interworkings of politics in developing countries and cringed not at the developing country officials but by the big donors and their behavior.

I used to be really radical and have answers. I don't anymore. I see each person has a perspective and most have hearts and souls (one person I thought lacking on both counts).

I enjoy reading what you all have to say. Maybe I will again be able to take a radical stand.

And thankfully I buy my banana's, mangoes, papyas and pineapples directly from the locals these days.

Brian Lewis said:

Well--have you bought any bananas recently?

Yes, WE have bananas. And like Nancy says, "Oil," too, but probably not Shell, although it comes outta one giant tank in New Jersey, very probably.

You're right, Brian. I am a murderer. I share this sad label with everyone in the world. Because violence is the way it is in the world today, all of US contribute to it, even those in remote tiny places.

I don't know how to change this fact. I work every day in every way possible, except for MY language, of course, to strengthen peace in the World.

I think WE could do better as a team, or as a planetary community.

One Human Family, One Peaceful World

Well--it is also possible to consider to write letters to the heads of these corporations, to write letters to their board members, to write letters to the firms which are big investors and to express concern and a wish...a desire to see things change and improve.

The idea of the quarterly report for corporations places a huge and unbearable expectation of much of corporate management...

To know and to do nothing...is that to be complicit? To ignore and hide one's head in the sand...people like Rosa Parks can provide inspiration.

I do not agree that you, or anyone else who is not directly involved in the physical acts and/or providing direct financial support is a murderer...and I suggest that it is not constructive to make such a statement.

I do enjoy being part of any change for the better. I like moven on because they try to inform (although it is biased but at least my kind of bias:) and then make it easy to write a letter or take action.

I think with big corporations we need to be as politically savy because of course the big corporations are running the world these days. They are the makers of policies.

I love that Rosa Parks was willing to be part of a movement. That she got trained and then was willing to take the training into action. It wasn't random it was well planned.

Brian Lewis said:

Well--it is also possible to consider to write letters to the heads of these corporations, to write letters to their board members, to write letters to the firms which are big investors and to express concern and a wish...a desire to see things change and improve.

The idea of the quarterly report for corporations places a huge and unbearable expectation of much of corporate management...

To know and to do nothing...is that to be complicit? To ignore and hide one's head in the sand...people like Rosa Parks can provide inspiration.

I wouldn't say that I was doing nothing, but I know that I could do more. What to do is MY main question. I wanna get bang for MY buck, but I wanna put my money and effort on those closest to me first.

Brian Lewis said:

I do not agree that you, or anyone else who is not directly involved in the physical acts and/or providing direct financial support is a murderer...and I suggest that it is not constructive to make such a statement.

Not seeing the blood on OUR hands is how Americans have lived from OUR inception. I have to admit it, not just as a Marine, but also as an AmeriKan, MY actions have been murderous.

The only question ALL of US can ask is, "How do WE stop doing the things that are killing Others?"

For some of US that will be "Living simply, so that Others might simply live." For Others that might mean committing every moment, every thought and every penny to living by OUR beliefs for justice. I fall somewhere in between.

But I know that murder is done in MY name every day all around the globe. To be conscious of that fact is a motivator for ME. I do not ask any one else to think, or to live as I do. Not that anyone would anyway.

Edit added the word "simply" after might and the phrase below:

One Human Family, One Peaceful Planet.

Thank you Brain for the invitation. I really do not know what boycot means.

However, according to my understanding, boycott may not have an impact. For example in Uganda there is a problem of the government trying to give away part of the forest to an indian called Mehta. People tried to boycott Mehta's sugar as a protest against the sale of the Mabira forest but there was no impact. Mehta wants to buy part of the forest and destroy inorder to plant more sugar-canes.

People had to go to the streets where by some people lost their lives. Infact an indian was murdered that day and 2 Ugandans also died. That is when the government knew people were serious about the forest.

So, there is that say which says "ACTION SPEAKS LOUDER".

I doubt that boycotts entirely imply inaction, Teopista. One of the most famous boycotts is for instance what is called Boston Tea Party of Dec 16 1773. It both entailed inaction - refusal to unload tea from China - and action: destruction of the tea.

It is really sad that Museveni is really mortgaging Uganda's forest cover to "development partners" while Africa and more specifically E. Africa is internationally poorly rated in terms of the forest cover it has.

RicHARD ~The Mahatma~ Makepeace said:

Brian Lewis said:

I do not agree that you, or anyone else who is not directly involved in the physical acts and/or providing direct financial support is a murderer...and I suggest that it is not constructive to make such a statement.

Not seeing the blood on OUR hands is how Americans have lived from OUR inception. I have to admit it, not just as a Marine, but also as an AmeriKan, MY actions have been murderous.

The only question ALL of US can ask is, "How do WE stop doing the things that are killing Others?"

For some of US that will be "Living simply, so that Others might simply live." For Others that might mean committing every moment, every thought and every penny to living by OUR beliefs for justice. I fall somewhere in between.

But I know that murder is done in MY name every day all around the globe. To be conscious of that fact is a motivator for ME. I do not ask any one else to think, or to live as I do. Not that anyone would anyway.

Edit added the word "simply" after might and the phrase below:

One Human Family, One Peaceful Planet.

I like how you have taken personal responsibility here. If each of us did and did something positive about it what a difference that would make. I'm reading about the Peace Pilgrim and she says some of the same things.